‘I suspect deliberate plans to scuttle 2023 elections’

An activist of over six decades, 89 years old Pa Babs Hussain (aka Aragbaye) is the current president, Africa – North Korean, Friendship Association. In this interview with GODWIN DUNIA, Aragbaye, who reflected on his activism days, spoke on the need for Amotekun to be armed, the 2023 elections, and agitation for Yoruba nation.

Nigeria just turned 62, at 89 years, what is your take on the state of the nation?
So far, it has been 62 years of stagnation and if, for any reasons you want to say there is any progress so far, it is far below expectation. I mean, expectation of what we fought for. Presently, the country is drifting and cascading from one mal-administration to another and is becoming more and more injurious to the people.

What pervades the atmosphere of today is uncertainty and hopelessness and I feel bad about this development and very apprehensive. I don’t know if the government is willing to do something to salvage the situation, otherwise crisis is very imminent; that would engulfed the entire country. It may start like the operation wetie that happened in 1965.

Do feel your years of activism and that of other comrades appear to be in vain?
That is not what I meant, because in those days of our activism, we recorded lots of success, including the Independence we are celebrating today. In those years, we had our shortcomings, which we failed to realise until now that realities are dawning on us as a country.

For instance, while in the struggle for both independence from colonial rule and against other internal strife, whatever method we had adopted lacked in some fundamental principles and with that, there were limited results achieved, and in some cases, we recorded outright failure. This is what applied to current activists and I think that area should be corrected.

Most activists often advertised individual persons than issues. They canvassed selves beyond the issues in both the media and public sphere and this deficiency invariably helped opponents to identified areas that were exploited against us. But that doesn’t mean we were not committed and dogged. Some of my post-independence fellow comrades include Aka Bashorun, Omojola, Ola Oni, Edwin Madunagu, Olu Awotesu and so on. Most of us in this group hardly appear in the media, but we operated unsung.

You made reference to operation wetie in the Southwest earlier, what really led to that, what happened then?
We reacted against election result, which were against Chief Obafemi Awolowo and in favour of Chief Samuel Akintola. The elections were faulted and things degenerated. I was among the front-runners of that wetie actions, including, Olu Awotesu, Soji Odunjo, Ayo Ojewumi (the then editor of Tribune) and Dapo Fatokun. The operation was in October 1965, but the crisis started in 1961, when I was a scholarship student in International Friendship University, in Soviet Union. The University was in honour of Patrice Lumumba. Before I left for Soviet Union, I was a member of Action Group (AG).

In 1961, the then Minister of Agriculture and Development in the Western region, Chief Akin Deko, went to the conference of UNFAO held in Rome, to plead for increment in the world price of cocoa product. While the conference was on, the regional premier, Chief Ladoke Akintola, denounced Deko’s presence and proposal for increase in price of cocoa at the conference and immediately, he was subsequently sent out of the conference. This affected the price of the commodity as it was reduced instead and it had consequential effect on Nigeria as the highest producer then. The AG therefore asked Akintola to be removed; that was what triggered operation wetie.  

You often write and refer to Chief Obafemi Awolowo, what is your perception of his person and as a socio economist?
Before I left the country in 1957, I had met Awolowo and interacted on a number of occasions; he was simple, very disciplined and tolerant of ideas. For instance, he was so tolerant of Akintola. Despite his limited knowledge and incompetence, he made him Chairman of Finance Corporations of Western region when AG came to power in 1951 and most members, like Remi Fani-Kayode, criticised his appointment. But Awolowo believed there must be room for learning and improvement for everyone.

On his socio economic expertise, Awolowo understood the philosophy of money more than any politician either dead or alive and he was a great manager of resources. In 1979, he warned former civilian President Shehu Shagari not to devalue the naira, because some forces lurking around him for sinister motives were putting pressure on him to devalue naira. Awolowo was part of the team that interviewed one of the best Central Bank (CBN) governors, Clement Isong. No doubt, his economic knowledge and advice contributed immensely to the development of Southwest region during his premiership.

So how would you react to the state of naira today?
Let me tell you this fact, most of our past and present CBN governors, apart from Prof. Charles Soludo, who is now governor of Anambra state, were not competent. They don’t understand the philosophy of money. They politicised economic and monetisation policies and that has been the bane of our economic situation today.

You wrote a book on Amotekun, the regional security outfit of Southwest, are you also in support of arming the outfit as proposed by Governor Akeredolu of Ondo State?
I raised the issue in the book, which means I’m in support of arming Amotekun, even to the teeth. I was at Ibadan during the inauguration of the outfit on January 9, 2020. There is need to arm Amotekun if we are serious and not ready to be overwhelmed by Fulani’s inordinate ambition.  

I think this is about the third time, the Fulanis have been intimidating and challenging the South in general, not only the Yorubas, on the concept of outlandish and invasion. They want to control the waterways and they are serious about it; forget all the political statements to undermine this fact. It is on that premise that Boko Haram and banditry came up.

I was among the first Yorubas that suggested a regional security outfit in 2019. It caught the attention of Govs. Akeredolu, Makinde and Fayemi, while Govs Sanwo-Olu, Oyetola and Abiodun were still waiting to hear from Asiwaju Bola Tinubu. There is need to arm Amotekun. This region is under the threat of Fulani hegemony and I really commend the boldness of the governor of Ondo State. That state is strategic; there is no region you are traveling to that you won’t cross Ondo State. He should go ahead and armed the outfit; I am ready to help in negotiation for arms in any part of the world, I know what it takes.

Why do you think the Fulani wants to take over the rest of the country?
It is an agenda; the current President is part of that agenda and they know why they wanted to do that. It started from their Uthman Dan Fodio, who perceived the country as ‘an estate’ of their forebears. This is a very wrong notion. That is why they are always using politics to define our history. We must not allow this; our history should define our politics not the other way round.

As a supporter of Yoruba nation as led by Prof. Akintoye, do you think this is achievable now that elections are closer and we have candidates from all the regions?
Firstly, I am very apprehensive of the coming 2023 election. There may likely be a masterminded crisis to take place in the entire country, because the hegemonies and Fulanis are under threat by this coming elections and I think they may create problems so that the purpose of an election would be defeated at the end. I suspect very strongly, plans that would scuttle the election. With the state of things, Asiwaju Tinubu is going nowhere. The structures of things currently are not conducive for national elections to thrive. And these are deliberate actions of the Buhari administration.

For instance, there are 262 commanding offices out of which personnel of Fulani extraction currently occupy 252. Now after Buhari, I want to see the southern president that would be allowed to change all these arrangement. These are some of the factors of the imminent crisis I predicted earlier.

Again, whether they like it or not, we are anticipating declaration of the Yoruba nation soonest. And the day the Republic of Yoruba or Oodua Republic is declared, the FG will say no! Then, the existence of Nigeria would be terminated and definitely, it won’t be a tea party. Yoruba is opting out of the 1914 colonial arrangement; it has reached advanced stage.

I often heard Buhari saying, ‘the unity of Nigeria is not negotiable,’ and I asked myself, ‘does he wants to force Yoruba to unite with Fulani? Is he aware that the Yoruba nation has been in existence since 1893? And that the Yoruba Obas met in 1937 on the same issue of unfriendly unity and that there was a conference in Ibadan in 1948, where Yoruba elders gave seven points agenda on whether they would remain in Nigeria or not?’ It was on this ground that Awolowo wrote his first book, Path to Nigeria Freedom and he suggested federal system of government for the country, which had been bastardised.

But one of the aspirants for presidency from the Southeast, Peter Obi has promised to dialogue with all secessionists?
I think the idea of dialogue or restructuring is too late, the question is, would they (North) agree? Except there’s divine intervention, because Buhari’s administration has not helped in that direction. The agitation for Yoruba nation has gone beyond the level of calling for dialogue in 2023. It has become crystal clear like the day. Going back may be too late for now. The United Nation has given its recognition to the movement and President Buhari has been notified.  

Your leader and friend, Pa Ayo Adebanjo recently canvassed support for Igbo presidency that, what’s your take on that?
Yes, I’m aware of that, when he specifically called for support for Obi.

Now, the logic behind that call is one, for equity; they need to have their chance. Two, is to unite the entire southern part of the country. You would recall that Ndi Igbo, through Dr. Nnamdi Azikiwe, have been supporting the north somehow than the Yoruba. With the insecurity crisis going on in the country, Gov. Samuel Ortom is often behind the Southern states.

So, Pa Adebanjo is working to create stronger ties among the southern states and its people.

I know Adebanjo very well; he has been like that for ages. Among the few Awoists we have today, Adebanjo is the only one that understands the meaning of Afenifere. And it means, life more abundant for all and sundry. All other so call, Awoists just mouthed Afenifere; they don’t live by it. That was why Awolowo suggested free education programme to liberate the people, because knowledge is power.

At 89 years, you are the president of African and North Koreans Friendship Association, how has that impacted on the continent?
So far, it has been helping to foster good relationship and enlightenment of that part of the world about the rich potentials of Africa.