Last week, there were reports that scores of unarmed protesters were fatally shot by security agencies in Onitsha, Anambra State while they celebrate 50 years of declaration of state of Biafra. This alleged extra-judicial execution sparked public outrage, culminating in the House of Representatives initiating a probe into the incident. Wahab Shittu, a renowned Lagos lawyer and human rights crusader in this interview with JOSEPH ONYEKWERE says the country can be taken up under the international laws if there are proofs that it exceeds it bounds. He also spoke on the anti-corruption campaign of the present government among others.

We have a recent security crackdown and extra-judicial executions against unarmed protesters in Onitsha. What do you think about government respect for human rights?
I don’t know about the extra-judicial killings. But what I know is that every government has the responsibility to guarantee law and order. Even in the spirit and letter of our constitution, the essence of governance is to protect the security and welfare of the people. So that is the primary duty of government. So if people decide to blow up pipelines and embark on massive destruction of property, and this is not something that is connected to Niger Delta alone, I am also including in this category the so-called herdsmen who are on rampage, no government will fold its hand and allow the economy to be grounded.

Should the culprits be rounded up and shot?
I am not saying that. What I am saying is that the government is resisting the attempt to ground structure of governance.
There are agitations for the actualization of the independent state of Biafra and the story since the inception of this government is that they have been cracked down by security agencies and fatally injured on each occasion.

I think there are standards prescribed by our laws for legitimate protest and that is also consistent with the fundamentals of democratic process. Nobody is denying people the rights of protest, but certainly, people should not hide under the right to protest to embark on secessionist activities against the government. Don’t forget that these fundamental rights are not absolute. They are subject to overriding considerations of defence, health, security and order in the society. So if those fundamentals are being trampled, no responsible government will keep quite. I also want to say that those embarking on those protests are Nigerians. I will advise that the government reach out and find out the deep and root causes of these grievances and find a way of addressing those grievances in order to take advantage of the unity and cohesiveness of our country.

You have a pedigree of rights activism. If people perhaps go beyond their rights of protest, what is the duty of a responsible government under such circumstance?
Government should round them up and charge them for the breach of peace.

Does that include execution?
Not at all! Nobody will sanction that! You may also ask; what are the activities of these people who are protesting? What have they been doing? We see evidence of massive destruction of property and public infrastructure. If you are the president of the country, will you fold your hands and watch? Government can also be taken up for killing unarmed protesters. There are international minimum standards which no government should violate. Even during the period of war, international law is not silent. So the law is always there. The country itself is not beyond the prescription of international law. There are agencies, structure and institutional frameworks that can be exploited when a government is exceeding its bounds. But you need to furnish proof. You need to be able to document some of those incidents outside the realm of conjecture, suspicion or speculation. You need direct proof. However, I think that government may need to revisit some of the factors responsible for the deep-seated grievances that are leading certain individuals to want to take up arms against their country. The two parties, particularly those who are protesting must know that they have elected representatives in the present democracy and that there is government in place with duty to enhance law and order. The leadership of this country has the responsibility to nip this crisis in the bud before it goes out of control. No country survives two civil wars.

What is your assessment of the anti-corruption campaign of the present government in relation to the judiciary?
The most remarkable feature of the Buhari administration as it affects the judiciary is the emphasis on anti-corruption as one of the cardinal principles of his administration. The indirect effect of his sloganeering on corruption is to send a very powerful message to all arms of government including the judiciary that it would no longer be business as usual. You can see that this has also translated positively in the judicial attitude and when the judicial attitude is positive, it would translate into several useful impacts including enhancing the quality of justice.

What is the evidence that it has impacted on judicial officers?
Lately as part of the ongoing reforms in the judiciary, the NJC came out to make authoritative pronouncement on the conduct of certain judicial officers, some whom were sanctioned. Even though the judiciary has always been embarking on self-cleansing, the realization that a new sheriff is in town has also increased the tempo of activities. You may not have seen the effect now in concrete terms, but I believe that necessary foundation is being laid, particularly given the quality of personnel at the head of various head of courts. The impression is that CJN is anti-corrupt and serious minded. If you equally observe various pronouncements he made, you will agree with me that he is following quite admirably the footstep of his predecessor who also had zero tolerance to corruption. There are trials going on now. I do not want to comment on the merit of those trials.

You are playing a key role in the trial of those that allegedly bribed judicial officers. Why are the judges not on trial? Are they on immunity?
Let me also make this point clear. The duty I owe as an officer in the temple of justice and the loyalty that I subscribe to is to the legal profession and the temple of justice. My friendship with anybody is defined by those standards. As I speak with you, I will be very reluctant to pronounce anybody guilty of any wrong doing until the full machinery of the court is activated. I will like also to say that I am not involved in the prosecution of any of these people accused of committing the offences. I was briefed to defend a civil suit filed by a senior advocate of Nigeria against EFCC. As you know, I am a retained counsel for the EFCC since inception. So I just treated it as one of the briefs.

As a counsel to the EFCC, you should be able to understand their mindset in this dispensation. Why is it that the judicial officers are not under prosecution?
I think that you are in a hurry. The emphasize, particularly this Buhari-led administration involving also a fine professor of law in the person of Yemi Osinbajo (SAN) as vice president is to insist upon standards, meaning that before prosecution is embarked upon in respect of any given case, there must be effective and efficient investigation. As you can see, they have also inaugurated an advisory board on prosecution; the reason being to ensure effective and efficient prosecution. If you have been following the work of the presidential advisory committee against anti-corruption, they have been reaching out to all sectors in the justice administration including judges in order to be able to deliver on effective and efficient adjudication. These tripods – efficient investigation, efficient prosecution and efficient adjudication are very critical to the realization of any meaningful result in the anti-corruption crusade. That perhaps explains why cases involving judicial officers are thoroughly investigated before they are charged to court. I can confirm to you that there is an ongoing investigation in respect of all those that have been mentioned in connection to one infraction or the other. People forget that we have at the helms of affair of the EFCC, a no nonsense officer, in the person of Ibrahim Magu, who is largely incorruptible.

The impression is that the government is not fighting systematic corruption but picking on alleged corrupt individuals. What do you think?
Such arguments do not hold waters and I will give you the reason. The question to be asked is: those that are being picked; do they have any case to answer? If they don’t have any case to answer, of course, the system is there to exonerate whoever is innocent.

The school of thought is not against the individuals that is being picked and prosecuted. They are saying that the government is not fighting corruption but prosecuting individuals accused of corruption?
I think the government is fighting corruption. Early in the administration of this government, apart from making it one of the cardinal pillars of its campaign, this government came into power on the manifesto of fight against corruption, fixing the economy and the issue of security. Those are the tripod in which this government came into power.

Have they kept their words?
Early in the life of this administration, they constituted a presidential advisory committee against corruption manned by a seasoned technocrat, Prof Itse Sagay SAN. All of us know his pedigree. They are working on institutions, systems, ethical and moral values and the legal frameworks generally and liaising with critical stakeholders. They are busy working. That is to show the seriousness. And I have also said that this same government has also constituted an advisory committee on prosecution. Beyond that, you saw the way this government has tried to block leakages associated with corrupt practices through the introduction of Single Treasury Account. When you want to fight corruption, you look at institutional mechanisms and administrative mechanisms for prevention. Again, you look at the foreign shuttles that the president had embarked upon to present the country in new light and again the recoveries.