Akinola: Nigeria is a facade, a mere dressing, forced unity

Outspoken immediate past Primate of the Anglican Church, PETER AKINOLA does not mince words, when it comes to critical national issues. In this interview with CHARLES COFFIE GYAMFI, he gave his verdict on the performance of the ruling APC government insisting that “Nothing has changed. The only thing that keeps changing in the last 16 yeas of our democracy is the faces of the people in power.” He also shared his opinion on restructuring of the country.
Have Nigerians got the change they expected from the APC government?
Judging by what I see around me, at the grassroots level and as a community person, I do not think the people have gotten the change they yearned for. I see young people still walking aimlessly about. There is no employment, no source of income. I see old people in the same way and even workers are complaining.

Indeed, in the last few months, the plight of workers seems worse than it used to be. I don’t think that is the kind of change they yearned for, when they voted in the last general elections, though this is not to say that we are hopeless, but, as at this point, we haven’t got there yet.

So far, what can you identify as the major mistakes of the government?
This government seems to be putting a lot of time and energy in the fight against the cankerworm called corruption. But as a government, fighting corruption should not be a kind of vindictive and selective activity; rather, it should be total and comprehensive. If you look at the names of people being arrested and prosecuted as of now, they are virtually from one particular political party and that is not good for the country. Fighting corruption is not just in the political terrain or in the civil service. It is an evil that has permeated every aspect of our national life, including the church, the mosque, and even market men and women. Corruption is a terrible thing, but we all have been living in a way that seems to contribute to its growth.
What I am trying to say is that selecting some people from a particular political party and you say you are fighting corruption won’t get us anywhere.

But the EFCC prosecutes people based on petitions written against them…
I don’t buy that idea because in other countries this is not what is done. Take England for instance. The way corruption is fought there is that when the agencies observe that an individual is obviously living above his legitimate income, they invite him/her to come and justify his income with the wealth he has acquired and if he cannot prove that he is the genuine owner of those things, he is in trouble. Nobody writes petition to anybody, it is the duty of security agencies to invite people for questioning. If such people cannot justify their acquired wealth through their legitimate income, then the government confiscates their properties.

So, if you are going to wait for the people to write petitions, nobody will write anything. Those who are writing are either those who have been cheated or those that didn’t get their own share of the booty. Ordinarily, an average Nigerian will not write petition against anybody because they are feeding fat from their purse. I expect government with all its apparatus to mandate its agencies to invite all those they know or feel are living above their legitimate income, whether in the military, politics or civil service, whoever they may be.

Do you share the view that Nigeria cannot make progress without restructuring?
What we call Nigeria today is just a mere geographical expression, apologies to those who hold the view that Nigeria’s unity is non-negotiable, which I disagree with. How can we say we are one country, one nation under God, when some people will wake up one morning and they feel like letting blood flow and start killing people for no just reason? Some will say their religion, tradition or custom permits them to do whatever they are doing. Some people will even say their religion permits them to marry underage girls, but my religion, my culture doesn’t permit that. These are some of the things that still divide Nigeria and we need to ask ourselves whether we really have common goal. Do we have common interest? Do we really have common vision? The answer is no, we don’t.

Each section holds very dearly whatever they believe is their tradition and culture and so they behave in a particular way. For us to have a united Nigeria of our dream, the various sections must come together and negotiate the terms and condition of national unity. You can’t impose unity on people. We have had military interventions in this country, we fought the bloody civil war for 30 months, we have had military regimes that ruled by coersion and all the rest of it, but have these brought about unity? No, we are still as divided as ever. The thinking of an average Ibo man today is different from that of an average Fulani man, while the thinking of an average Yoruba man is altogether different, but we are united by force and that can’t happen. Unity must be based on trust, on consensus of ideas, opinions, aspirations and hopes of the people. But we don’t have that and until we are able to see ourselves as a people with a common destiny, common aspirations and hopes and share our pains and joy together as a people, we cannot talk of being a nation.

The way it is right now, we are far from being a united country. What we have here is a façade, a mere dressing, forced unity. You are aware that intolerance happened in the Anglican Church worldwide. The church in Nigeria has been fighting this homosexual issue in the last 15 years or so now. The leaders’ concern in the United Kingdom and elsewhere is that we should all come together and be united and let the world know that we are one. But some of us said, ‘look, we can’t have a united Anglican Church, when we teach and preach different things. The Bible is our common platform, but when you have deviated from Biblical teachings, we can’t be a united church.’ And that is the basis for the fragmentation of the Anglican Church today and it is the same thing that is happening to Nigeria as a nation.

It is not unlikely that if the people from the six geo-political zones in Nigeria are brought together today and they are asked the kind of Nigeria they want, some of them would say they want a kind of Nigeria, where the Sharia law reigns supreme. Others may say no, they want a parliamentary system of government, while some may want the presidential system of government. The question now is: how do we harmonise all these views and opinions?

Of course, out of the six, two or three or four may agree on the kind of country they want, while one or two may say ‘no’ they want to go their way. When we get to that point, it will be clear that those that have chosen to disagree with the majority have chosen to go apart and there is no sin in that, but saying that we want to stay together by force will not work. It is after we have identified those desiring to walk apart that we can now design a new set of rules and regulations that will be binding and enforceable. Not when you have a constitution in Nigeria, where some rules are enforceable in Sokoto and not in the Abeokuta area of the country.

Ask the average young man, who is part of the Biafra agitation, ask the average young man, who is fighting on the side of Boko Haram what they are fighting for and they will tell you that they don’t want to be part of Nigeria anymore, that they want something different and nobody is listening. You can suppress them today, but in the next few years, they will come back again. The Boko Haram you see today didn’t just start now; it dates back to 1967, when they started with Araba, which means to separate. It later metamorphosed into the Maitatsine riot, the Bauchi riot, the Kafanchan riot and Kaduna riot among others. All of them have the same agenda and the same goal and what they are saying is that the Nigeria they are living in today is not the Nigeria of their dreams.

Are you surprised about the revelations being made from different corruption cases under investigation?
Not at all because the seed has been sown a long time ago and it is merely germinating and bearing fruits now. Corruption has always been part of our national life since the very beginning and nobody has had the gut to fight it, nobody has had the courage to bring it to the level, where it will no longer be an issue. In the good old days, during the days of baba Awolowo, Nnamdi Azikwe, Okpara and so on, there was corruption in governance, and even Awolowo, Azikiwe and many others were indicted for corrupt practices, but I can say it was mild in those days because there were things to show in governance. It was like live and let’s live. But now, what you have is that of I may live and you perish.

Corruption has got to a level, whereby nobody in governance cares about the governed. I have not seen any politician who has what it takes to bring about the Nigeria of our dreams, where corruption will no longer be an issue.

Should former President Jonathan be questioned for supervising a corrupt government?
Which government in this country is not corrupt? It is only those people who feel they were cheated that are accusing others of corruption. Even today, corruption is prevalent. Jonathan is a Nigerian and he was in charge of this country for some period of time and things that shouldn’t have happened, happened. Under the laws of this country, if inviting him for questioning will solve the situation, I’m in support. I will never support the idea that somebody should be above the law, as nobody should be above the law. But if he has done some things wrong and there is enough evidence to prove it, then he should be prosecuted. But they shouldn’t give the impression that Jonathan is the Devil’s incarnate, because those things they are going to invite and question him about are still prevalent in the larger society.

Should Senate President Saraki resign?
It is true that anybody that is alleged to have committed an offence is perceived to be innocent until found guilty. But at the same time, in decent societies, when high ranking officials are alleged to have done such terrible things, he leaves that office honourably, so as to give the law agencies free hands to carry out their job so that his office will not interfere with the process of investigations. That is the normal thing to do in civilised societies, but are we that civilised? My answer to your question is yes, if we were in a civilised society, he should have resigned. This man should have left his office honourably and allowed the law to take its course, that is the decent thing to do.

But the man is still sitting there, presiding over lawmaking and these laws he is making, he is being alleged of breaking them. For me, this doesn’t add up. So, his being there has cast aspersions on the integrity of the entire law making process.

What is your comment on the way the Senators have comported themselves as far as Saraki’s case is concerned?
Senators were elected to go and make laws that will make Nigeria a better place for all of us to live in, but they are now abandoning their constitutional responsibilities and what they are paid to do, following somebody to court. If I had my way, I would have sued them for wasting Nigerians’ money and time.

All this is happening and the people are keeping quiet. One would have expected them to march on the streets in protest…
Politicians know that an average Nigerian is not only docile, but also gullible. So, they know they can buy their way through. It is a question of going to these people and giving them a little amount of money and that is the end. No matter the number of allegations you bring up against these politicians in their various communities, it will not see the light of the day.

But things cannot continue like this. What is the way out?
Few years ago, during Jonathan’s administration, when he was talking about the transformation agenda, I had the opportunity of making a public statement and told him that he cannot transform Nigeria’s political sector or the civil service by fiat; that will not happen. Transformation is from the individual’s heart. Nigerians have to be transformed from within and this is where the National Orientation Agency (NOA) comes in. This is where the churches and mosques come in. Bad as it is now, I believe there are still some few good people around who have not soiled their hands in the evil of corruption. We need to identify these people and begin to design a programme of inward transformation of the rest of Nigerians. But as it is now, we are only patching things up and it won’t work.

Are you worried about how long it took both the Legislature and Executive to pass the budget?
I’m not surprised because the only thing that has changed in Nigeria and the only thing that keeps changing in the last 16 years of our democracy are the faces of the people in power. Every other thing remains the same and will remain so until we have done the right thing. Whether the politicians are PDP or APC is not the issue, they are the same corrupt Nigerians. Every one of them is just looking for what to get for himself/ herself.

The Presidential system of government gives room for a lot of lobbying. If you want the Senate to quickly sign your budget, you lobby them and maybe President Buhari is not the type of person that lobbies and that is why it took that long before it was signed.

Do you support the idea of capital punishment for anyone found guilty of corrupt charges?
How many people are we going to kill? Those being tried today are those that have had their cups full and over flowing, but that doesn’t exempt any of our politicians and some of the civil servants in the country. Currently, about 27 states of the Federation are crying that there is no money to pay their workers. But is it that there is really no money? No, I do not believe so. There is money to run government, to do what is required, but there is no money to satisfy the greed of state governors and their officials. They have been so used to stealing, and that is why they are saying there is no money.

Let me ask you a question. Who monitors the spending of the money coming from the Internally Generated Revenue (IGR) of the states? Which auditor monitors what money comes in to the purse of the states from IGR? They only tell us what they want us to hear, after they have stolen the bulk of their own share.

Who is responsible for auditing the so-called security votes from the Federal government down to the local government? They say it is for security, but when it comes to security, I don’t think Nigeria has had it this bad before, with a lot of kidnappings, armed robbery and Fulani herdsmen’s attacks being witnessed by Nigerians across the country. So, where are all the security votes coming to the states?

When these chunks of money are put together, you have enough money to run government, but they don’t have enough to satisfy their greed. If everybody found guilty of corrupt charges should face capital punishment, then every Nigerian will have to face the music because we all are guilty of wrong doings or supporting wrong doers. But that doesn’t mean that the guilty ones should go scot-free. I don’t think capital punishment is the answer.

PETER AKINOLA

How would you rate the Judiciary in the fight against corruption so far? Would you suggest that a special court be set up to try corrupt cases?
We have all the courts that we need to prosecute and jail anyone that is found guilty of corruption. But we shouldn’t forget that our judges are Nigerians, just as the prosecutors and the prosecuted. The evil called corruption has eaten deep into the fabrics of every Nigerian. I don’t have any record of any judge that has been accused of corruption, but I think the media is awash with stories indicting judges of corrupt practices and there have been allegations and counter-allegations. So in that light, I don’t think the judges have given their best so far. When someone is being accused of corruption and the evidence before you is very glaring and all you have is a stay of prosecution or stay of proceedings, by that you are delaying justice and as they say, justice delayed is justice denied. So, we don’t need all these tactics by these lawyers.

Politicians are already fighting over who becomes what in 2019 and we are still in 2016, are you worried about this development?
For me, it is the height of foolishness because no man can ever predict what will happen in the future. Look at the case of Abubakar Audu in Kogi State. Here was a man who did everything humanly possible to become a governor, but just when he was to become the governor, he was taken away. Man proposes but God disposes. Man has no right or spiritual power of his own to say that ‘tomorrow this is what is going to happen.’

But by claiming that they know what is going to happen in 2019, they are claiming to be God, which to me is sinful.
With what they are doing, they are not only insulting God by claiming to be mini gods, but they are also insulting Nigerians. To me, they are only displaying arrogance by beginning to determine what is going to happen by 2019 in 2016. It is pure arrogance and act of foolishness. Yes, you can have ambition, you can aspire but when your ambition and desire come to the level of certainty and you begin to speak with authority, as if you have control over your life, then that person should be examined very carefully because I think something might be wrong with such person.

Some people believe that Nigeria is facing a gloomy future. Is there still hope?
If we have the courage to do the needful, yes, there is hope, but I have not seen the courage. We are denying the fact that Nigeria is just a mere geographical expression. We are denying the fact that Nigeria’s future is still negotiable. All that is needed to make Nigeria great are being denied, so we are merely patching up things, which is what is making Nigeria’s future gloomy.

But if we summon the courage to address the issue of Nigeria’s restructuring from the six geo-political zones, then there is truly hope. The country and the name Nigeria were just forced on us by the colonial masters and we accepted it.

Your advice for common Nigerians to ensure that their leaders do not take them for granted…
There is something we call passive resistance without violence. Over 70 million unemployed Nigerian youths can compel the government to do the needful, but they are not organised. They are as divided as the country itself. This is because mostly in every community, you have the Senators, House of Representatives members or Governors, who dole out peanuts as handouts and the youths would rather live on handouts than work very hard and earn a decent living to take care of themselves and their future.

My advice is that Nigerian voters should all come to a common understanding that they are not destined to live on miserable handouts and that they can be great. But they need to hold their government responsible to provide them enabling environment that will promote such opportunities that will enable them to be productive and be fully engaged in order to earn a decent living.

And when they are voting, they should know the kind of people to vote for. They shouldn’t vote on account of handouts politicians are going to give them, rather, they should vote based on their conscience.